I just purchased 3 Magic filters for my Nikon 10.5 mm Len that should be arriving tomorrow from B&H, good timing Alex. I have a question about using these types of filters for the best results ?

I was talking to Kirk today from UR-Pro and we were discussing white balancing.
Besides using presets I sometimes white balance on a white card threw a UR Pro filter with good results.

Kirk says that’s wrong. If you custom white balance you should do it with out the filter attached, than replace the filter for the best results.

I would like to hear experiences from other users, what gives them the best results, presets, customs, or auto white balancing ?

Alex what’s your preference ?

Thanks,
Marc

Well if its anything like video then you WB with the filter on... very hard to WB without the filter.

I have had loads of trouble gettting my D70 to WB at all, land or water, it just won't take. Perhaps with filter it will be easier

I’ve had similar problems with several cameras in the past that would not white balance. Make sure you have enough light before you white balance. The filter reduces the amount of light to the point were it can’t measure properly. Try using a higher ISO and balancing, than reduce it back.

Marc

According to the magic-filters site you do the WB when the filter is on the lens.

btw. Alex, very good site, very informative and well build.

I have use a UrPro SW filter on my last trip.
I have "white balance" on a grey card but I have see that if you are between 0-5 meters the results can be very bad.
Follow picture I have "White Balance" on the white ballon but look att the result
BAD BAD PICTURE
Click to view attachment



I think that when you do white balance, using a White or grey Card, the angle off the camera & card is from importans. Especially if you are in shallow waters

Lambis

Lambis at this shallow depth, if you put too strong a filter you are pushing your color space out of control, in a way you throw enough red at it that it can't remove it. this shallow you need very light filtration maybe 5cc red or magenta depending of the water quality.

intersting result anyway. look like a seal colony after a few white sharks went trough it

And you should always white balance with the filter on the camera, the camera needs to know everything there is to correct in order to give decent result, doing it without the filter then adding it would give a way too reddish result. Check with Kirk again, maybe something got loss in the conversation or maybe i'm doing thing wrong but my result seem to answer that question.

Cheers

Jean

This filter is the New URPRO SW. Kirk told me that its work from 0-5 meters. It is not a strong filter.

Maybe i have forgot to white balance again on this photo. I was down to 5meters - white balance - take the shot- come up take another one...
Result: Horror

Anyway. this filter need realy carful white balance to archive great results. On the end is a great filter from Shallow waters.

Lambis

I think that's what you did, balanced at 5 meters and went up, honestly if your very shallow as in the picture I would try auto white balance since there is no radical color shifting involved, might make your life easier. less fidgetting with controls more concentration on composition.

Have a good trip amigo, and my regards to Neptune

Lambis. To WB correctly you need to WB in the same direction you are shooting your shot, and at the same depth. As Jean says, you need to use the filter to give the camera the info it needs. If you WB while pointing the camera straight down at the card (with sun behind you) it will obviously give different results when you ascend and point your camera up at the sun. (This is the tendency for newbies, point camera down at slate) To WB properly do it in the same direction, angle, and depth you are going to shoot. You would be amazed at the WB diff in video even btwn 5 and 3 metres...

Not really sure what Kirk is talking about when he says to WB without filter and then add filter, makes no sense. If you WB with filter at 20m (60ft) then ascend to 10m (30ft) you will have a heck of a lot more red in your frame due to less significant light loss. Always WB when you change depths. Obviously using stills with a filter behind the dome as a screw in or as a drop in behind the lens WBing is not possible without filter and adding later...unless you want to take off your dome at depth

Mike

I know it now I have make exact the same stupid thinks in my last trip... not the same direction - point camera down - not same depth
but i am lerning from my errors.
Alexs Filter will be a big help becauce its work from 0-15 meters

On the end if I have not time to recalibrate I go with auto WBalance

Ah yes, believe me took me a while to figure it out myself...
even worse with video as you WB at a 45 degree angle and then the dang manta swims over your head and "Hello!" lots of red in your shot as now the camera is pointing straight up at the sun...very annoying! Can't win em all unfortunately...

Ok I think I'm being a little dense.

Why white balance in the water where it is difficult to get right ? Why not just white balance in ACR once you are back at your computer. You are shooting in raw right ?

I can of course see the difference with video but on stills....

Off scource you cane do it later on ACR but I have found that you get better results with manual white balance becauce
a: you dont remember always the light & colors from the photo that you take.
b: you dont spent hours with ACR.
c: Its always better to have direct from camera right results. Then with ACR you can just finecalibrate the photo.

I have found that if the white balance is not correct somtimes is very hard to fix it and that sometimes white balance with ACR mess up you other colors

Lambis

I am with Lambis on the approach. You can always set WB in the RAW converter - but why not set it at the time of shooting. It takes just a second on a camera like the D70.

To clarify Marc's original post. Magic filters (www.magic-filters.com) are not available yet as we are waiting for all of our stock to arrive. They are not available from B&H. They will only be available from us (certainly to begin with) and the price includes postage to anywhere in the world.

The Magic Filters do come with detailed instructions on "How to set WB", "How to shoot with filters", "Ideal conditions for filters", "Post processing tips" etc etc.

Should be ready to go public in the next few days.

Alex

p.s. I found that the UR Pro SWCY worked well at 2-3m I think that the problem that Lambis had must be right at the surface as I didn't see it in my tests.

Magic Filters showed up today out here in the backwoods of Missouri!
Can't wait to try em out!

Thanks Alex, Peter!

Ditto,
Lauderdale by the Sea, Florida

Marc

Thanks guys. Yours were pre-orders that we were able to process early. We officially open today. I am going to close this discussion and start a new one to announce Magic officially going on sale (so we don't end up with a load of discussions running at the same time). Alex