There is many users her that have a D2X or a Canon 1Ds

Most off them have buy those cameras when the d200 or the 5D was not exisitng
and there was only comsumers models like 20D or D70 and the big pro housings

Now there are two new cameras that are very near to the pro models and not as expensive. O.K. the d200 is not out on the street but still we have read the reviews.

So Alex , James, Luiz and everybody else that drive the big boys ..

What choice would you have made if you were to buy a camera today??


Lambis

The reason I bought my camera has little to do with the camera and a LOT to do with the housing.

I bought my Canon 1D body because of the excellent housing, which uses a huge viewfinder, great port mounting system, and good build quality.

My camera is "only" 8 megapixels, but they are good ones. There are 4 other bodies that will fit in my housing, so I hope to someday soon upgrade to a 16 megapixel camera.

The downside is that my housing is large. If I could get a housing for the 5D or D200 that has a big viewfinder and good port mounting system, it would be tempting due to the smaller size.

Cheers
James

James that is one of the reason that i ask.

Normaly pro housings like Canon 1Ds or Nikon D2X stay longer on the market and offen they come out with a advanced version like Canon 1Ds Mark II

So a housing for those cameras will stay longer with you that housing for consumer cameras like my Nikon D70s

So maybe the cameras are more expensive and the housings to but if you like to upgrade very offen maybe to go BIG will on the end save some money.....

Lambis

Like James, for me the housing pretty much came first, then the body. My 1DII & 1DsII are my first digital slr bodies (autofocus as well ). I was worried about not having a bright viewfinder and also getting something that I would feel good about using for the long run. I expected that a camera would be released within a year or two of the 1DsII that would have similar or better image quality like the 5D or D2x but in this business you have to expect that no matter what you get. It all boils down to what you feel you can live with during the expected life of the equipment you get.

Keith

Well seeing as i have a D70 and there was no D200 or D2X when i bought mine i would still stick with the cheaper one rather than the D2X, no way in hell i could afford that puppy!

I'd buy a D2X. Although I'd probably wait a few months as hopefully the price of the D2X might come down a bit once the D200 supply has caught up with demand.

Although I have to confess that I left the D2X on the boat yesterday for the second dive and took down my Nikon S3 and Oly C40!

Alex

Alex

The D2X will go down in price... must go becauce i think Nikon take to mutch for this camera. I think 1000$ less will be great :-)

About your Nikon S3. I am to thinking to go with a second mini camera.
First becauce my Girlfriedn dont like my Nikon .. to big..
Second Becauce I dont like to see my Nikon in the arms off others :-)

How is the Nikon S3 , are you happy with it?

Lambis

And thats when the Great Hammerhead swam within 3 feet of you....

I would take a serious look at the D200 and I think that in the end I would have bought one (but only after comparing it side by side with the D2x, especially AF). Having said that, I don't regret buying the D2x for one second. If the question was "if you had a time machine and could go back in time knowing that there would be a D200, would you still buy the D2x?", my answer would be yes. The price difference is already worth the photos I took this year.

Price of the D2x is already down in the US. It is selling for $4,299 at BH and there is that $500 rebate if you buy any lens with it.

Luiz

I bought the 20D a year ago and I'd buy the same camera today. No question.

My cameras are tools. The underwater part is a hobby I can write off my taxes.

I still have not found a crushing reason to need anything more than a D2H. With that said, the D200 is a non-issue for me.

<shrugs> I'll probabally use my tax refund to pick up a D2X; I'll let you know how much my mind changes.

All the best, James

I love my 1DsMkII, but if I were doing it today, I would buy a 5D.
- Much more manageable size (uw AND above) than the 1D series,
- I believe Seacam (and others) will have top-notch housings for it shortly, and
- outstanding "bang for the buck."

Then again, having a "series" (like the 1D) with a built-in upgrade path of bodies that will fit in the same housing, and superior weather-proofing, DOES make some sense in the long run...

I have think for a long time the same about nikon D2X. You buy onluy one housing and the you upgrade the camera body

I am not sure if nikon will come with a new model for the d2X if yes it is very intesting to wait and just buy a d2X now when the prices are going down...


Lambis

I now have 3 x 1DS bodies which give me superb quality images, very high camera build quality and I can put them in housings which will take all other 1D series cameras. The 1DS is available used but in excellent condition at about the same price as a new 5D (and the last one I bought had 3500 shots only on it).

Given that my cameras earn my living I would probably still go with a 1D series camera today if I had to start from scratch - the only possible alternative for me being the 5D but I don't like the viewfinder as much

Hi Lambis

I shoot with a D70 in a Sealux housing and have a backup D70 body that I use topside. I also just purchased a Nikon S3 and Nikon
housing to use as an occasional prop for my model and also to serve as a back up should anything happen to the D70. The S3 should be easy to take along to dinner etc for casual snapshots.

Anyway...here's my 2 cents. I am committed to using Nikon systems. Presently, there is no great need for me to upgrade my D70 to a D200. Although, I am thinking of perhaps getting a couple of D200's when all the fuss dies down and supply cathces up to demand. My plan would be to then sell one D70 body and then use a D200 for topside work. The other D200 body would go into a Sealux housing (when available). I would not need to purchase any ports since I already have them for the D70 setup. So then I would have two housed systems. I would likely use the D200 for U/W models, wide angle work etc, and the D70 would be set up cor macro work. It is more likely that a wide angle shot may be enlarged to extreme sizes for a poster or advertisement than a macro shot of a critter.

I'm only considering this path because I shoot professionally and some of my images are sold through a stock library. If I was shooting purely for my own pleasure I do not see any need to trade up to a D200 since the D70 produces very good images.

Personally, I have no interest in the Nikon D2X camera. I think the price is way to high to take it underwater not to mention the added weight and bulk this camera has over the D70/D200. I'm sure it's a wonderful camera and would work well in places where you don't have to lug it around with you like say in a photo studio.

Fyi...for those considering the advantages that Canon's full frame 35mm sensor camera might have over Nikon's DX-sized sensor cameras. I've attached a link to an article on the Nikonians website that discusses the physical advantages/disadvantages of Nikon's DX sensor. As with all things, consider the source. The article is penned by a Nikon user...but it seems to clarify/affirm why Nikon and Canon are seemingly marching to different drummers.

http://www.nikonians.org/html/resources/ni...sors/index.html

Looking forward to hearing how Alex made out with his Nikon S3 trials in the Caymans.

Cheers,

Jett

I am very happy with the choice that I made. I think 5D and D200 offer better value for the money than 1Ds MK2 and D2X. When I bought the D2X, if D200 was available, if money was not an issue, I still would go with D2X as it is still a more capable camera. Although I have to admit that whether I am using D2X, D70 or D200, the weakest link in the process of getting a good picture is still me and not the camera.

Canon has been very nice to 1D series camera user as far as housing is concerned but I would not bank on Canon or Nikon making the next generation 1D or D2 in the same body. However I don't see myself outgrow the capability of the D2X anytime in the next several years and the only reason to upgrade would be the "my toy is bigger and newer than your toy" syndrome .

I am a bit skeptical about the article on Nikonians. Sure the theory about light fall off on a larger sensor sounds plausible but I never heard of anyone complaining about light falloff on the image of 1Ds/5D camera unless the complain about quality of image around the edge of the wide angle lens is a result of light falloff rather than lens resolution in that area.

Dx sensors have some distinct disadvantages too. The smaller photosites mean that diffraction softening becomes a problem at f11. The smaller photosites also mean that noise at higher ISO's is always going to be higher than for a FF camera.

A different drummer indeed. The question is: which system is better for wideangle shooting. The factors are available lenses, and sensors. The Nikkor system has the 12-24DX and the 10.5DX The latter is a very good combination, but the 12-24DX is only a mediocre wideangle lens. The perfect system, IMO would be a FF nikon system with the 17-35 AFS

For Canon, you can use the 15mm fisheye with the FF sensor and get great results, even in the corners. So in this regard, the two systems are more or less equal. The Canon 16-35 on FF is decent, but not great. It yields equal or better results than the Nikon 12-24DX system. Where the Canon really shines - at least from the results I've seen is with fast fixed primes like the 24 1.4 or the 20 1.8's. Nikon doesn't yet have an equivalent prime DX lens.

Cheers
James

"The perfect system, IMO would be a FF nikon system with the 17-35 AFS."

Bingo!

The perfect system is the one that gets wet as often as mine does...

(Thats to James for that Canon drivel... )

I was hopping, when i have started this topic, to see how you guys
choice a system :-)

Its very intresting to read the different opinions and to see that on the
end it is not just camera build quality but more or less commitment to Nikon or Canon, and Lens choice.

Like the fakt that most of you will go again with a D2X without to really know if the d200 is working the same underwater. I mean nobody have test the d200 in UW.

Thanks to James about the canon issue. I to think that Canon is walking a other way that nikon but on the end it is a great UW system.
A 5D and a 15mm as example will be a great wide angle system.

For me its more a question off many details.
Today if I have the choice, i would look to 3 cameras
The D2X, the D200 and the 5D. I would not go with a Nikon D70s again.
Not becauce its a bad camera - the camera is great - but becauce for my kind off shooting only with available light..

But on the end Mike is right...



Lambis

"I mean nobody have test the d200 in UW."

As of yet I don't believe anyone has tested a production D200 above water and posted a subsequent review either. So far only previews have been completed and posted with pre-production D200 models. To the best of my knowledge there's been no actual reviews of production models yet posted. A thorough D200 flogging by someone like Phil from http://www.dpreview.com/articles/nikond200 has yet to be seen.

I just bought a Canon 5D and would do it again. The quality of the pictures is amazing. 13mp allows one to crop the crap out of a photo and still get a good looking pic.

That being said, housings were/are an issue.

I just placed an order for 2 UK-Germany housings that should be delivered by mid-Feb so I haven't had it UW yet.

The plan is for one to be set up with the Canon 100mm macro and the ring flash that UK makes. This wil yield a basic point & shoot macro rig with TTL.

The second will use the Canon 14mm WA. Santa brought a f1.2 85mm that might fit in the dome so I might monkey with that. No TTL on this as my plan is to use my old dual Ike 200 setup (and potentially Alex's Magic Filter).

I'd like to promise a review to y'all but it is really cold in the California waters this time of year so I cannot promise anything before early May.

No Camera, no review - Phil Askey

http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp...essage=16368893

Apparently Nikon has decided early reviews by Phil are not important or counter productive. They've not sent him a camera to review.

I don't think this is the reason. Apparently Nikon never sent him cameras for early review, his D2x review was posted on June/01 2005 (ship date was Feb/25). It takes him a long time to review even Canon cameras (if you are implying that Canon sends him cameras for early reviews). The Canon 1Ds MK II started shipping on Nov/15 2004, Phil's review was published on Oct/11 2005.

The D200 started shipping on Dec/15, that's only two weeks ago, and the demand is enormous. He will review it in due time.

That could be the reason. However, Phil wrote:

"I'm getting a gentle flood of emails asking when I'm posting my review of the D200. It's a seriously difficult thing to do without a camera, which I still don't have (despite other sites having one)."

which seem to imply that he knows others have received the camera for review. In fact there are reviews with production cameras from other places. Here's one example:

http://www.caborian.com/index.php?option=c...=1&limitstart=1

Herb,
Something's wrong with my computer. I can't read the writing on the review you linked to. None the less, looks like it could be actual review and an interesting read... It's dated December 28.

I think he just couldn't find one in a shop to buy or rent and the other sites could. He didn't say that Nikon provided cameras to the other sites. Also, he never published any review of any brand camera less than a month after the shipping date. I seriously doubt that either Nikon or Canon (or any other brand) provides all their camera models for free for him to review.

James - you loved that lens when you owned Nikon. Look at your old posts! Personally, the only fault I can find with this lens (for uw purposes) is its build quality - it doesn't inspire me like the 17-35 to hold it. Image quality wise, it is one of the sharpest nikkor zooms around! The mild distortion at 12mm is irrelevant underwater, and its resistance to flare is legendary.

I have minimal experience with the canon system, and despite my protest I've been handed a 1Ds II to get familiar with - I'll give a report soon. So far it is a lovely camera to hold, but like my brief experiences with the Rebel and 20D - the UI is like another language to me. No housing yet, hopefully I won't have to go down that road. I can't comment on the Canon wides yet but the complaints I've heard have been corner sharpness and falloff - you'll find neither of this in the 12-24 DX.

In response to the original post - Like other D2x owners I have no regrets, but if I were buying today I'd seriously consider a D200. I could own the camera and housing for the cost of a D2x alone! Now that I've owned a D2x, though, you couldn't pry it from my cold dead hands.

Hi Kasey,

I loved the 12-24DX because at the time - before DX lenses - it was miles above the only other alternative - the Sigma or Nikon 14mm. Now, after using the 17-35, and the Canon lenses, I've changed my opinion of the 12-24DX. It's a lot like shooting the 18-35 f3.5 on a ff camera - just average, a bit plasticy, and way overpriced (IMO).

Cheers
James

If $$$$ was no option Canon 5D and a few EF lenses.

Or 2-4 Canon A620 and or Fuji E900 cameras, Ikelite housings for both with the new DS80 strobes, adpater lenses for macro and wide angle,and to top it off maybe a dual processor Mac G5 with 23" or 30" cinema display

Just kidding

(Maybe not?)

dhaas

Works for me. Just tried it again. Perhaps you can start at

http://www.caborian.com

and work your way down.

In his second post on that thread Phil wrote:

"Yeah and we're wondering why if they can get them into stores they can't get one to us for review..."

which seem to imply that he does get cameras from the factory for review and does not have to shop for one, and the present situation with the D200 is unusual.